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Hey guys! I know it is a sore point with artists (trust me, I understand how you feel very much!). Often times, I’ve found that people genuinely just don’t realize what goes into art. Even my family, who know I put many many hours, or even weeks, into a single pieces… have a hard time understanding just how much goes into making art both in time and expense. To people that aren’t neck deep in art, it can almost seem like magic or even just immense innate skill (which often is just a disguise for a lot of hard work and practice).
I always have to remind myself of this when encountering this type of thing. I suspect that no one meant offense here, and I’ll ask everyone to please be careful with responses. Everyone is allowed to have an opinion, but remember one of my forum mottos: Be excellent to each other (and party on)!
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My art: featherdust.comyeah,…..just last week my next door neighbor wanted me to sculpt her a special tiger just for her son’s birthday the next week, and she wanted it to be at least a foot tall….and her budget was only $100. She got really upset when I had to explain to her it simply couldnt be done, and that i dont take commissions.
sigh. I sincerely wished i could do something to make her happy….but the time and effort that’s put into a piece simply doesnt compute to many people. I mean…even with something like figure skating….you see that triple axle and it looks so easy when it’s just a jump on the ice….but the months, even years of work that went into being able to DO that….
An interesting tidbit…..The average person spends 3 seconds glancing at a piece of art before they decide whether to look closer, or move on. So, the weeks and months worth of work culminates down into a total of 3 seconds to get people’s attention.
Well I could just not reply, but figured I would anyway. I am with Jennifer – party on…..
You artists that were offended by my comment mistook my intention. I was defending artists, and defending the person who listed the PYO – both – and that’s one thing I hate about typed word sometimes folks read it wrong, or misinterpret the meaning. I was comparing the fact that someone felt the pyo was worth a dollar amount, and that artists also feel their work is worth a dollar amount – the sculpt didn’t cost that much nor did the paint.
YOU (generalized) were offended because I said that it was no different for an artist to ask $250 for a painted sculpt when the paint didn’t cost that much (and the paint did not cost ‘that much’ – btw you hopefully aren’t using a whole bottle on every piece haha and you get to use all those bottles for lots of sculpts) and the person who was selling the pyo was asking ‘their wanted price’. No difference.
I don’t know why that would be offensive, nor insulting. If anything, it should have been taken as a compliment but really, I wanted to make a point and nothing more.
Everyone has a price for everything.
But PLEASE accept this as an apology to those who interpreted my posting in an insulting manner, it wasn’t meant to be. This could be why some folks decide not to post and rather, read. I’m still baffled why it was even taken wrong.
i’m not trying to attack or anything but i wanted to point something out. Whether you say something or type it it doesn’t make a difference in how it is perceived, for instance if you said this out loud to someone it would sound extremely insulting. Such as this statement,
“I don’t know why that would be offensive, nor insulting. If anything, it should have been taken as a compliment but really, I wanted to make a point and nothing more.”That makes saying “But PLEASE accept this as an apology” completely void.
And again the paint comment “(and the paint did not cost ‘that much’ – btw you hopefully aren’t using a whole bottle on every piece haha and you get to use all those bottles for lots of sculpts).
It was very clear how some of us feel about the paint and the expense and was explained in plain detail. So why say something that sounds so grating when it’s clear that it’s a sensitive subject?When it all comes down to it the best way to try and not sound insulting, rude, insensitive, ect (i’m being generalist not saying you where anyone of these) is by thinking about how your words might effect the others who might hear it or read it and considered if the words are sharp sounding or soothing.
For instance in a conversation/debate if you believe the other person is wrong in there view. Using the words “Well your wrong” would not only instigate an argument it would sound harsh and irritate the other person. But by phrasing yourself like this “Well that was not the understanding i had on the topic, though would you explain why you believe this?” it is soothing and allows the other person respect and makes it easy to have open communication so both can understand each other.
i hope you don’t find this insulting or think i am trying to correct you, i’m just trying to throw out some food for thought for everyone….i get similar speeches from koishii a lot.
::shakes head:::
Okay I give up, this should be MY last post on this topic. To dissect piece by piece what I said, is rediculous. I apologized and apparently a segment of the board enthusiasts insists that I am an ogre for stating facts: paint doesn’t cost that much (generalized and sure, buy gold infused paint and that will cost a lot) and sculpts don’t cost that much.
The point I was making: I feel strongly that anyone should be able to ask a dollar value for any item they own, be it a blank canvas or a painted one.
sigh……to put in a nutshell why so many are offended…on a forum where many artists (some of which actually make their living from it) post and congregate was essentially the same as going into a professional hair stylists parlor and telling them their scissors didnt cost that much, in regard to the price they put on their work. Essentially, with art, you’re paying for a service, in part, as well as an item. People who buy a piece, then resell that same unaltered piece, have not put the time and work of a professional service into it.
Calling all worms… calling all worms… please return to the can from whence you came!
I’d like to be totally honest here, at the risk of alienating whomever, and opening even more worm cans.
When I first posted, I was definitely feeling judgmental about the beginning bid price. More than twice the original cost?!? And, knowing from experience, if I were the buyer and found out later I’d been “duped” into paying so high a price, it wouldn’t matter to me how altruistic the motives behind the sale were. I would feel cheated. Of course, that would all be MY fault, not the seller’s, for not having done the research (I mean, come on, how hard would it be to Google Windstone and click on the website?). But I’ve paid too much for stuff before, and being raised Catholic plus being a little OCD and needing money right now, I feel guilty when I spend “too much”, and I’ve been known to return an item just so I can buy it back three days later to reap a 10%-off sale. I’m cheap.
It had even occurred to me, when I first posted, that the seller might be on here. So I can’t claim innocence on that. I kinda wanted to call them out, so to speak. Of course, in my head, I was still dealing with a greedy seller who was aiming to make a killing on some poor uninformed sap. I had considered contacted the seller through eBay and mentioning the current Keeper asking price, and had found myself wishing I could somehow post something on eBay that people would see attached to the listing, showing a link to Keepers here in the store so everybody could see the “real” price.
None of it was my business. Sellers certainly CAN ask whatever they want to, and it’s up to the buyer to make their own decision, do their own research, and live with the results. And informed buyers get the freedom to walk away from any given sale, and feel however they want to about it. Does the world need more judgmental sniding* like mine? No, probably not.
So, I’m wrong. I have the freedom to feel however I want to about other people’s choices, but there’s no need to share that feeling. The world has enough crap going on. Do I really need to add my drop to the suck bucket by pulling a power trip off somebody else’s asking bid on eBay? … Not so much.
My apologies to all.
*Sniding – it’s like sniping, except with being snide instead of using a rifle. I make up words sometimes if I can’t think of one that works. 😳KoishiiKitty wrote:Poems wrote::/
No real difference, it didn’t cost that much to paint. Windstone does it when Melody paints a sculpt, sometimes half of you all could do the same job, but bid it up sky high – bravo for Windstone, for making so much money.
Yeah, I think that one stung a little bit. 🙁
Jerusha…I dont think most of the upset is actually to your post…but to the above quote about artists versus making money.
Ok, I have read everything here…. and I am in no way Offended by ANYthing Poems wrote……I know she did’nt mean to offend ANY artist here!
I’m at a loss for words…. I understand paints and supplies can be VERY costly ( personally I have at the very least $1000+ in airbrushes, paints and supplies) But honestly someone with some talent can paint a PYO with minimal supplies and at a minimal cost
Im guessing thats all she ment, plus she was making a comparison to the person selling the blank Keeper for more than store price V’s someone selling a PYO at whatever price they want to sell it for.Even I (Knowing how costly art supplies and time invested into a PYO are) am surprised how much “Some” of the PYO’s starting prices are, but again its up to the artist to determine the value of their work,
I paint because I enjoy it, and if anything I paint sells its a bonus!Lets all just take a deep breath! 😆
Poems wrote:apparently a segment of the board enthusiasts insists that I am an ogre for stating facts: paint doesn’t cost that much (generalized and sure, buy gold infused paint and that will cost a lot) and sculpts don’t cost that much.[/color] [/b]
I think Purplecat put it nicely, and so did grayfire artz. I’ve reread all of the posts that pointed out that what you said was a bit offensive, and I don’t think any of us are attacking you, we’re simply trying to point out why what you said was taken as an offense, and (this is my personal opinion) seemed a bit insensitive.
People are still posting on the topic because it just seems like you’re not getting why we are saying these things when you continue to mention the same (offensive) statement over and over.
Once again, not attacking you, just trying to get you to see why some of us are a little irked by the entire thing.
Commission spots are currently closed! Please message me for details.
Please visit My Webpage to see my art and PYO's that I've done in the past!WHY Can’t WE ALL JUST GET ALONG!!!!! 🙄 😈 XD
Wow, I don’t look at a post for a few days and look what happens. Well, I was belittleing anybody just throwing in my usual comical comment. If a seller can get that much, then good for them. Afterall, I have paid more then that for a blank Keeper at one point when they were hard to get I’m sure. A Windstone is only worth as much as someone is willing to pay for it. If someone wants it bad enough, they WILL pay for it. We have ALL found that out one way or another whether it be a PYO or an ebay piece. 🙂
However, that comment about the painted ones being expensive and “not costing much to paint” sort of struck me a bit. I sell my Keepers for at least $250 normally (which was the figure thrown out there)
PLUS, I ALREADY HAVE craploads of materials I have gathered over the years so I barely need to spend much more then the PYO itself and the shipping to get it when I paint them for resale, but does anyone take into consideration the WORK, SKILL, and most importantly, the TIME it takes to paint one… and paint it well? I’ve spent up to 40 hours on one PYO, bet your butt I’m not doing all the work for peanuts. :nea: Why bother painting them at all if that’s the case. Materials should be irrelevant in the argument in my opinion. (Not saying materials should not be considered, but time is money people)
I commission Koishii and grayfire all the time and have absolutely no issues with what I pay for my commissions because I know the effort that has to be put into some of these pieces. They charge more then I do usually, and I don’t complain one bit about it cause I WANT THEIR style and ONLY THEY can paint it the way THEY paint it! 😆 You pay for the skill and one of a kind style each artist possess. Unfortunately, not a lot of people appreciate the time, passion, and individual talent that has to go into something like that. I guess when you sit down and actually try to paint one, that’s the only time you know the work involved.
It’s like when people want to commission me for a costume. People think $800 to $1000 is a lot for a costume when the materials cost about $200-$300, but yea… 80 hours of work later it’s only about minimum wage.
Got a busted Windstone?
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*OPEN for repairs**SEEKING GRAILS*
Arc-en-ciel Emperor
Siphlophis Male Dragon
Calypso Hatching Empress
Ivory Moss Sitting Baby Kirin
Tattoo Mother Kirin
Emerald Tabby Male Griffin
Tie Dye + Orion Hatching Royalty
Indigo Rockfish + Flame Tabby Little Rock Dragons
Dragon Quail + Obsidian Frost Old Warriors
Betta Sun Dragon + Male Dragon
Dreamscape, Orion, Poison Dart, Fireberry, Spangler + Tigerberry DragonsAw jeez, this thing has exploded. I really don’t blame it though… Sorry Poems, that response gets me too. I don’t think you’re trying to be hurtful, there is just a disconnect of understanding going on here.
To put it very simply, and materials aside. Let’s say two people used a crayon and a piece of paper to draw, for the exact same amount of time. One person is an accomplished/published artist, one person has never drawn a bean in their life. One charges $1 for their doodle, the other charges $50.
This is not some arbitrary number because the artist feels they can get away with charging you $50. You are paying for not only an artist’s time, but the extensive years and years and their entire life that they have devoted to learning the amount of skill you like looking at.
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