Clear coat issues–too darn shiny! [Resolved]

[Victoria]

All right–I recognize I may be the only person on here with this issue, but…

I really dislike high gloss finishes on fur & feathers. On scales, great, but the rest, I really want a satin or even matte look, something that mutes the reflections of light rather than leaving pinpoint hotspots everywhere. Looking at my two copper patina pieces, they both have the finish I want, for the most part: a silky, look that leaves a diffuse reflection of the light sources in the room, rather than eye blinding highlights everywhere.

And they’re both metallic paint beneath that finish. I know it can be done.

Which brings me to my current problem: the shiny wolf. The night wolf I did most recently is still driving me up a wall. He is all metallic or interference over black. I get that he’s always going to have a certain amount of shine–pics in my thread were taken before his clear coat, and he had some then. Actually, I liked his look before any clear coat at all, he was just about right. But he needed sealing. I used the same satin finish on him that I did on my other two PYO’s. (DecoArt’s DuraClear Satin) THEY turned out fine. But he was painted with higher end, non craft paints that already had a somewhat shinier finish than the craft stuff does.

He gleams. EVERYWHERE. He’s sitting in the exact same light as the coppers. I can’t tell by looking at him half the time if I’m seeing pieces of dust in his finish or if it’s yet another overly glossy highlight. His fur glows with the lights of the room. His wings are so glossy, you can kiss off all the softer detail work I did on them–it’s hidden by reflections they shed, and only the really bold lines show.

I went out and got the DuraClear Matte–Michaels was out of both Golden & Liquitex’s matte varnishes, and at any rate, I’ve heard the Liquitex leaves things tacky for eons, which isn’t good either. The weather here, as usual, sucks for spraying…and we have neither garage nor an unfinished basement, so brush on finishes are best for me. The sprays also smell pretty strongly, and I’m having some breathing issues from the latest medical stuff.

I slather him in Matte finish. I swear he’s laughing at me. It has no effect. If anything, he’s shinier. I add another coat after the first. No change. I begin to wonder if the bottle is mislabeled. I give in, tape his eyes, hold my breath, take him out into the cold and damp really fast and hit him with Krylon’s matte. Run him back in the house to warm up. I’m 99% certain he’s even shinier now. And the smell is giving my lungs fits. Looking at him up close, I can see a few spots that *might* be duller. Maybe. Could be the paint fumes going to my head. Even dry to the touch, he basically has that wet, high gloss look.

If I were working with model railroad stuff, I’d cover him with Testor’s Dullcote, which will flatten any gloss to dead matte (flatter than I want, but better than this!), but that’s enamel based–a no-no on gypsum. The other trick from my miniatures & prop making days would be rubbing him with super fine steel wool, but there’s a big risk that will take off not just the shine, but his paint.

Meanwhile, his shiny backside (well, and every other part of him) is mocking me. I’ve honestly never encountered anything like this.

So, the question becomes–is there anything left to put on him…and will I start to run into problems now that he has several different brands and finishes of sealants coating him already (all acrylics, but…)? Any techniques to I’ve missed? Try another coat of the matte brush on–maybe it needs more to dull things down since it’s going over a satin?

Or do I just put him somewhere really dusty & let nature take it’s course? Hmm…near the litterboxes might get that smug little smirk off his face….

[Bodine]

LOL Dilemma,dilemma….good luck with that one.I bet if it falls though it won’t chip. 😉

Every act matters.No matter how small💞
(Wanted......Brimstone Lap)
Male Hearth....one day🤞Dream on.

[dragonmedley]

I’d brush on another coat of matte and display him in an area with no direct light on him 🙂

Read my books! Volume 1 and 2 of A Dragon Medley are available now.
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[Victoria]

LOL–*hides shiny wolf in dark drawer*

Hubby’s comment: “Get used to it.” (I stuck my tongue out at him.) Then he suggested the dusty area idea, so at least I wasn’t the only one to come up with that!

And of course, the more I look at the thing, the shinier it gets. Shortly, I’ll be convinced he’s actually covered in diamond dust. Or is being lit by some sort of super secret laser beams I can’t see. *covers wolf’s head with tin foil, dull side out, of course!*

Sigh. FWIW: There seems to be a fair amount of dispute on the intarwebs about how many layers of varnish you can put over acrylic–most seem to recommend just two (of course, this typically refers to paintings, not sculptures), but others suggest more, and of course, I know we have people here who do multiple coats. It does seem that there shouldn’t be an issue using matte over satin (or gloss); it’s recommended in several places to dull down a gloss finish, so it supposedly works for other people. I think for tonight, I’m going to sit on my hands to keep from messing with him, and try another thin coat of the brush on matte tomorrow. I thought I stirred it well enough, but that seems to be a common issue with matte brush on finishes, so I’ll mix it extremely thoroughly first, and then just have to be very careful about bubbles/foaming.

If that doesn’t work, maybe he WILL go in a drawer until the weather warms up, then I’ll take him outside and layer 20 coats of Krylon matte spray onto him. That oughta teach him! 😀

[Sirithiliel]

I hear your pain…I have a PYO griffin I did and she’s far too shiny for my liking. I look forward to hearing any possible solutions you get offered on this matter, I might try it out =P

[Tara]

Mixing non gloss brush on finishes is very important. First time I used satin finish it looked like the gloss. I discovered that the satin finish is the same as the gloss just with some solid in it to dull it. The matte is the same as the satin except with a higher concentration of solids. In order to get the full effect you need to make sure all of the solid that is settled at the bottom of the bottle is mixed in. If the matte doesn’t do the trick I would try an ultra matte. I know Liquidex makes an ultra matte and it’s supposed to have a totally flat finish. As for the dry times for Liquidex it’s mostly just the paints that seem slow to cure. For me I find that they aren’t quite tacky but they don’t feel cold and smooth for at least a few days to a week. The finishes don’t have the same problem. I find they feel cured within 24h. I’ve had no problems with the finishes and I’ve used them on all my pieces.

[Sirithiliel]

Mixing non gloss brush on finishes is very important. First time I used satin finish it looked like the gloss. I discovered that the satin finish is the same as the gloss just with some solid in it to dull it. The matte is the same as the satin except with a higher concentration of solids. In order to get the full effect you need to make sure all of the solid that is settled at the bottom of the bottle is mixed in. If the matte doesn’t do the trick I would try an ultra matte. I know Liquidex makes an ultra matte and it’s supposed to have a totally flat finish. As for the dry times for Liquidex it’s mostly just the paints that seem slow to cure. For me I find that they aren’t quite tacky but they don’t feel cold and smooth for at least a few days to a week. The finishes don’t have the same problem. I find they feel cured within 24h. I’ve had no problems with the finishes and I’ve used them on all my pieces.

are those materials available in any common hobby store like Michaels or Hobby Lobby? =) I appreciate the assistance, the shinyness on my griffons is a cause of annoyance for me as well

[Tara]

Mixing non gloss brush on finishes is very important. First time I used satin finish it looked like the gloss. I discovered that the satin finish is the same as the gloss just with some solid in it to dull it. The matte is the same as the satin except with a higher concentration of solids. In order to get the full effect you need to make sure all of the solid that is settled at the bottom of the bottle is mixed in. If the matte doesn’t do the trick I would try an ultra matte. I know Liquidex makes an ultra matte and it’s supposed to have a totally flat finish. As for the dry times for Liquidex it’s mostly just the paints that seem slow to cure. For me I find that they aren’t quite tacky but they don’t feel cold and smooth for at least a few days to a week. The finishes don’t have the same problem. I find they feel cured within 24h. I’ve had no problems with the finishes and I’ve used them on all my pieces.

are those materials available in any common hobby store like Michaels or Hobby Lobby? =) I appreciate the assistance, the shinyness on my griffons is a cause of annoyance for me as well

I know Michaels carries Liquidex products(in the artist paint section) and should have the matte finish but the ultra matte is a little harder to find and not all places that carry Liquidex have it. I have seen the ultra matte in a hobby store here(or at least the spot for it). You may have more luck finding the ultra matte at art stores that carry Liquidex as they seem to carry a more complete selection.

[Bodine]

Diamond dust!Now THAT’S an idea!! :bigsmile:
Don’t hide it away.I am sure if you don’t like it,someone else will,rehome it,do another.Just a thought.

Every act matters.No matter how small💞
(Wanted......Brimstone Lap)
Male Hearth....one day🤞Dream on.

[Victoria]

Diamond dust!Now THAT’S an idea!! :bigsmile:
Don’t hide it away.I am sure if you don’t like it,someone else will,rehome it,do another.Just a thought.

You should have heard me threatening to paint a red glitter thong on him yesterday–complete with tiny dollar bills sticking out of it. “You want to sparkle? I’ll make you freaking sparkle!” I haven’t seen my husband laugh that hard in a long time. J)

Problem with rehoming him is that this boyo is going nowhere. He’s based on a character of mine that I love very much (who is also, BTW, a stubborn, recalcitrant SOB sometimes. I should have predicted this…). I’ve had plenty of offers to take him, and a couple people who’ve asked if I’ll do another one–possibly, but not an identical one, because this one is too important to me. No…I really do have to get this right. And besides, I refuse to be outsmarted by fake rock!

FlamingDragon–thanks for all the help. I didn’t know that Liquitex makes an ultra matte finish; it might be something for me to keep on hand for certain projects. Michaels does *usually* carry a fair amount of their product. Unfortunately, when I went yesterday, they were out of a LOT of stuff, including the regular matte, and nearly all of the Golden’s mediums and finishes too. Amazon also carries a fair amount of the Liquitex line, usually with Prime shipping (or their order $25, get free ground shipping deal).

Also very good to know you find the Liquitex paints to be more “sticky” than the finishes. I’ve heard complaints both ways, and people who like both, so perhaps this is a situation where I need to try it for myself. I’m brand neutral–paints are W&N Galeria, mediums & retarder are a mix of Liquitex & Golden, so I’m certainly willing to give the Liquitex finish a shot if this next coat of DuraClear doesn’t cut it. I haven’t yet applied that next layer as I’ve been a bit sick this morning, but some time this afternoon, I’ll stir up the DuraClear matte and give it another shot.

[Carolyn]

Maybe if it’s humid and things don’t dry well . Talk to Bayoudragon about what she uses . She uses a type of sealer that dries in the south where she lives . Hot and humid South . Maybe she can help you . I have 2 pieces by her and it’s UV safe too . So the sun won’t harm the painted piece .

[Victoria]

Thanks, Sasha–but not a humidity issue in this particular room. If anything, it’s the driest room in the house, because there’s almost always a space heater on. It’s currently about 80 in here–versus 65 in the rest of the house. LOL

Latest update: Extremely well shaken DuraClear matte has zero effect on shiny wolf. To test it further and make sure it really was a matte finish, I did try it on a bit of black canvas I had nearby, which was triple gessoed in black at the factory, so it’s a REALLY flat black. One coat of the Matte DuraClear left it with a reasonably matte finish, just a bare hint of satin. I think if this had been the first coat put on the wolf, it probably would have worked, but it’s not enough to even start to dull the current shine on there now.

Next I tested something else on the non-display side, taking some of the original base black and using it as an antique. This *does* dull things down more than anything else. Unfortunately, no amount of wiping brings back up the interference and metallics that were dry brushed on originally. It dulls them down to near non existence too. So I can do that, but then I’ll have to spend a fair amount of time redoing the dry brush work (which probably wouldn’t work due to the multiple layers of clear coat at this point–he’s losing texture with those)–and I can’t really antique the wings, due to the design on them, which would leave them shiny.

So that’s not really an option either.

I think I’ll start the hunt for the Liquitex ultra matte next, or a true mattifying spray–I’ll just have to hope for decent weather soon with the latter, and have my husband do the spraying.

And well, I guess this is a learning experience!

[Sirithiliel]

Thanks, Sasha–but not a humidity issue in this particular room. If anything, it’s the driest room in the house, because there’s almost always a space heater on. It’s currently about 80 in here–versus 65 in the rest of the house. LOL

Latest update: Extremely well shaken DuraClear matte has zero effect on shiny wolf. To test it further and make sure it really was a matte finish, I did try it on a bit of black canvas I had nearby, which was triple gessoed in black at the factory, so it’s a REALLY flat black. One coat of the Matte DuraClear left it with a reasonably matte finish, just a bare hint of satin. I think if this had been the first coat put on the wolf, it probably would have worked, but it’s not enough to even start to dull the current shine on there now.

Next I tested something else on the non-display side, taking some of the original base black and using it as an antique. This *does* dull things down more than anything else. Unfortunately, no amount of wiping brings back up the interference and metallics that were dry brushed on originally. It dulls them down to near non existence too. So I can do that, but then I’ll have to spend a fair amount of time redoing the dry brush work (which probably wouldn’t work due to the multiple layers of clear coat at this point–he’s losing texture with those)–and I can’t really antique the wings, due to the design on them, which would leave them shiny.

So that’s not really an option either.

I think I’ll start the hunt for the Liquitex ultra matte next, or a true mattifying spray–I’ll just have to hope for decent weather soon with the latter, and have my husband do the spraying.

And well, I guess this is a learning experience!

I got some Krylon matte finish and it did wonders on my griffon =) now I need to take new pics for my PYO gallery for her. Thanks for the tips and advice!

[Victoria]

Thanks, Sasha–but not a humidity issue in this particular room. If anything, it’s the driest room in the house, because there’s almost always a space heater on. It’s currently about 80 in here–versus 65 in the rest of the house. LOL

Latest update: Extremely well shaken DuraClear matte has zero effect on shiny wolf. To test it further and make sure it really was a matte finish, I did try it on a bit of black canvas I had nearby, which was triple gessoed in black at the factory, so it’s a REALLY flat black. One coat of the Matte DuraClear left it with a reasonably matte finish, just a bare hint of satin. I think if this had been the first coat put on the wolf, it probably would have worked, but it’s not enough to even start to dull the current shine on there now.

Next I tested something else on the non-display side, taking some of the original base black and using it as an antique. This *does* dull things down more than anything else. Unfortunately, no amount of wiping brings back up the interference and metallics that were dry brushed on originally. It dulls them down to near non existence too. So I can do that, but then I’ll have to spend a fair amount of time redoing the dry brush work (which probably wouldn’t work due to the multiple layers of clear coat at this point–he’s losing texture with those)–and I can’t really antique the wings, due to the design on them, which would leave them shiny.

So that’s not really an option either.

I think I’ll start the hunt for the Liquitex ultra matte next, or a true mattifying spray–I’ll just have to hope for decent weather soon with the latter, and have my husband do the spraying.

And well, I guess this is a learning experience!

I got some Krylon matte finish and it did wonders on my griffon =) now I need to take new pics for my PYO gallery for her. Thanks for the tips and advice!

Oh, fabulous news! I’m so glad to hear it. Did it end up as a really flat finish, or more of a satin? And how many coats did you use?

[Sirithiliel]

Thanks, Sasha–but not a humidity issue in this particular room. If anything, it’s the driest room in the house, because there’s almost always a space heater on. It’s currently about 80 in here–versus 65 in the rest of the house. LOL

Latest update: Extremely well shaken DuraClear matte has zero effect on shiny wolf. To test it further and make sure it really was a matte finish, I did try it on a bit of black canvas I had nearby, which was triple gessoed in black at the factory, so it’s a REALLY flat black. One coat of the Matte DuraClear left it with a reasonably matte finish, just a bare hint of satin. I think if this had been the first coat put on the wolf, it probably would have worked, but it’s not enough to even start to dull the current shine on there now.

Next I tested something else on the non-display side, taking some of the original base black and using it as an antique. This *does* dull things down more than anything else. Unfortunately, no amount of wiping brings back up the interference and metallics that were dry brushed on originally. It dulls them down to near non existence too. So I can do that, but then I’ll have to spend a fair amount of time redoing the dry brush work (which probably wouldn’t work due to the multiple layers of clear coat at this point–he’s losing texture with those)–and I can’t really antique the wings, due to the design on them, which would leave them shiny.

So that’s not really an option either.

I think I’ll start the hunt for the Liquitex ultra matte next, or a true mattifying spray–I’ll just have to hope for decent weather soon with the latter, and have my husband do the spraying.

And well, I guess this is a learning experience!

I got some Krylon matte finish and it did wonders on my griffon =) now I need to take new pics for my PYO gallery for her. Thanks for the tips and advice!

Oh, fabulous news! I’m so glad to hear it. Did it end up as a really flat finish, or more of a satin? And how many coats did you use?

I actually used only one coat, the can said to use one. I think it is satin Like, not certain though. I’ll put up a before and after pic for you to see =)

[Author]

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