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THANK YOU for clarifying Pam! These are easy rules to follow.
I was thinking of printing up a “Certificate of INauthenticity” to keep with any repaint I did in the future that explains what the color was, why it was repainted, and all of the legal disclaimer-type stuff that goes with these. Seems like most collectors store their COAs anyway, so if something like an estate sale were to happen, well, if the COAs for the pieces were found the COinA would be with them too. Another way to document the repaint… Would this be helpful or hurtful for Windstone?
SORRYTOBUMPTHISTHREAD O.O
See, the problem with the whole “certificate” thing is, it can and most likely will get lost (specially in the event of moving or selling, dying etc). This is where the problem arises. The problem with repaints is, even if the felt is marked.. the felt can be torn off and thrown away. If the painter tears the felt off and marks on the actual sculpture base that it’s a repaint, you can just as easily paint the entire base a color and void that note. Laminated note attached with string to a piece? Scissors.
Even if you were to write “repaint” on the ACTUAL SCULPTURE in paint or what have you, a skilled painter can come along and cover it up.
See how these can all turn into problems? If someone is so hell-bent on making a repaint unknown as such, it’s an easy thing to do.I’m neutral on the repaint thing, so I have nothing to say about it all.
If someone cares that much about making a repaint look authentic, a repaint NOT existing probably isn’t going to stop them. They can just repaint a windstone themselves. So far, I think there is only the one case, with the red dragons, where someone was actually deliberately trying to pass repaints off as authentic. At least, that’s the only case I have heard mention of.
My “tips” are intended for situations involving regular people who might encounter the repaint in the future and who are not familiar with windstones (which I believe was what John was referring to, regarding “confusion takes hold in the re-sale market”?). I suggested making an actual tag for a repaint because writing on the pad could become obscured from just general use.
Well, as Pam said, the big issue for us is simply the confusion of trying to tell the Knockoffs from the re-paints. Something comes up for sale on eBay that is suspicious and we either have to make a determination from the picture what it is or I have to buy them and get a closer look. Not a huge problem yet, but if there are enough re-paints out there it will be. We understand that broken pieces are valuable and restoration is not always possible but I don’t think we want to bring it to the site.
I will now think out loud: If they were so great that we could sell them through the site as authorized re-cycled/re-painted Windstones it would be fun and solve the problem but they are not all going to be up to the same quality standard and we and the painter would have to make a profit on them. That probably wouldn’t work with the amount of time that goes into the painting and it would limit the painting to select painters. Might hurt some feelings of those who felt they should be included and weren’t. Your comments are welcome.
I actually think this is kind of a cool idea. I know there are a lot of very talented painters who would love to paint official Windstones and being able to sell them through the store as official repaints would be gravy for those folks.
Maybe set up an application process? They have to show samples of their work (on PYOs), examples of repairs they have done, etc. You could set up a special store for them and charge a commission like ebay does. They could also potentially work on a contract basis and since the factory would be “certifying” their work, they could include a letter or certificate or something saying they were an official repairer/repainter.
Yes, some people wouldn’t qualify – but that’s like any job or certification. 🙂
Doing this would, I think, also cover a lot of the trademark issues. And, if it worked well enough, maybe eventually some of those folks could be “promoted” to paint blanks like Helen and Jennifer do and you could sell them on ebay.
Probably a lot of logistics, but, as I said, it’s a cool idea.
Sounds interesting…however I’d also worry about it being profitable for those involved.
Perhaps make some sort of arrangement where people trade in a damaged windstone for a small amount of store credit? That might put an incentive into people wanting to bring the damaged windstones to you. Plus the store credit thing might balance the outgoing funds to get the damaged pieces in the first place.
Hard to say how it’d work, but it is an intriguing idea.
I will now think out loud: If they were so great that we could sell them through the site as authorized re-cycled/re-painted Windstones it would be fun and solve the problem but they are not all going to be up to the same quality standard and we and the painter would have to make a profit on them. That probably wouldn’t work with the amount of time that goes into the painting and it would limit the painting to select painters. Might hurt some feelings of those who felt they should be included and weren’t. Your comments are welcome.
:jawdrop:
John I might have to hug you.
I am all for this! I was planning on keeping my repaints, but this could feasibly give incentive to artists to do some amazing repaints, to have them considered for the recyled program!! I am very very much all for seeing if this could work!
Commission spots are currently closed! Please message me for details.
Please visit My Webpage to see my art and PYO's that I've done in the past!But.. if it’s JUST a damaged Windstone, what would Windstone want to pay for it for?
If it was a repaint, and a very well done one – I can guarantee that people would pay good money for it. This definitely COULD benefit Windstone and the artist both. If the artist is also the person repairing the damaged Windstone they could take before pictures (of the damage) so it could be documented, then the pictures of the process, what materials they used to fix it, and then the piece before it was repainted.
This would also avoid people from grabbing good Windstones off the shelf to repaint them, and would allow Windstone to draw a line between “that wasn’t damaged enough to justify what you did” and “wow, look at that! it’s like a new piece!”
Commission spots are currently closed! Please message me for details.
Please visit My Webpage to see my art and PYO's that I've done in the past!I will now think out loud: If they were so great that we could sell them through the site as authorized re-cycled/re-painted Windstones it would be fun and solve the problem but they are not all going to be up to the same quality standard and we and the painter would have to make a profit on them. That probably wouldn’t work with the amount of time that goes into the painting and it would limit the painting to select painters. Might hurt some feelings of those who felt they should be included and weren’t. Your comments are welcome.
:jawdrop:
John I might have to hug you.
I am all for this! I was planning on keeping my repaints, but this could feasibly give incentive to artists to do some amazing repaints, to have them considered for the recyled program!! I am very very much all for seeing if this could work!
*glup*
You and me both, Hannah 🙂 !
If this ever became a reality, I would so go for this.I will now think out loud: If they were so great that we could sell them through the site as authorized re-cycled/re-painted Windstones it would be fun and solve the problem but they are not all going to be up to the same quality standard and we and the painter would have to make a profit on them. That probably wouldn’t work with the amount of time that goes into the painting and it would limit the painting to select painters. Might hurt some feelings of those who felt they should be included and weren’t. Your comments are welcome.
:jawdrop:
John I might have to hug you.
I am all for this! I was planning on keeping my repaints, but this could feasibly give incentive to artists to do some amazing repaints, to have them considered for the recyled program!! I am very very much all for seeing if this could work!
*glup*
You and me both, Hannah 🙂 !
If this ever became a reality, I would so go for this.I will break my vow of silence to say I would be on board with this in a heartbeat.
Got a busted Windstone?
drag0nfeathersdesign@gmail.com
*OPEN for repairs**SEEKING GRAILS*
Arc-en-ciel Emperor
Siphlophis Male Dragon
Calypso Hatching Empress
Ivory Moss Sitting Baby Kirin
Tattoo Mother Kirin
Emerald Tabby Male Griffin
Tie Dye + Orion Hatching Royalty
Indigo Rockfish + Flame Tabby Little Rock Dragons
Dragon Quail + Obsidian Frost Old Warriors
Betta Sun Dragon + Male Dragon
Dreamscape, Orion, Poison Dart, Fireberry, Spangler + Tigerberry DragonsThere is a lot of hobby artists like myself that would love to do this, EVEN at a cut in the pay you would be getting out of it.
From my end, it seems like a very intriguing idea…it has the possibility of a really good payback too..(no one has set this up for high quality casts before..in this way, it could be a huge promotion, and it could bring in more revenue than anticipated and grow)
But I don’t see this as a safe bet, so to say. There is no garuntee, no other real market to compare to this idea to try and gauge it…and in that sense it is pretty risky. There probably is just as much likely hood that it would not bring any benefit to the company and may even cost more in the end. Could there be other issues that make complications for the compony from this too?
I’m not strong in mathematical calculations and I do not have large business experience, but that is my best evaluated speculation of the idea based on the basics I do know.
The inner artist in me would love to push logic aside and say “DO IT!” but it must bring benefit to the company first because it would a greater tragedy to find out there was more risks involved that were not thought of and see it cost the company, something that would affect Collectors on a wider scale.
One issue I do see is that some collectors do like to commission pieces done because of very specific preference. So even if this is set it, it is highly likely that there would still be underground repainting as a store option would not necessarily provide a collector with just what they are looking for.
Here is a question to all of the artists that are saying yes to this. Even I have to look at this. Could you honestly hear the words,” Sorry, but your painting is not good enough.” and still support it? Just think about it. If this is a serious idea being considered hear, and we are getting the privileged of being able to share our opinions on this idea, we need to be equally serious about the realism of this idea.
I see your points Koishii.
As far as the commissioning thing goes (where people like to commission a specific piece), how might it be any different if people “squeaked” on the forum for a recycled, repainted piece? Sure, maybe no one has one available to do, so the squeak would likely be unanswerable for a while, but I think collectors will appreciate the idea of getting a recycled and repainted Windstone that has some “authenticity” to it. Instead of having to hide it, they’d be able to show it off! Instead of having to be hush-hush, they’d be able to be proud that they saved a Windstone and helped an artist, and the company all at the same time.
How might this be if it was done on ebay, like many Windstones already are? If it was authenticated by Windstone and came with a special COA explaining its recycled nature, maybe Windstone could do a low-cost “test” of this and see how it goes. Ebay is generally a pretty good gauge for the demand on an item. If people like the idea, it should reflect in the bids.
Maybe Windstone could find a couple of volunteers (after application process and possible rejection of course – I’ll get to that later) to send them a piece and see how it goes. Maybe the artist could foot the bill for the initial shipping cost, it would likely not be much of a bill in any case and I bet there are a ton of artists on here who wouldn’t mind it. That way, the only cost that Windstone would have for its initial trial would be the ebay fees.
As far as rejection: speaking as an artist, I know I wouldn’t like being rejected, but I would understand that it was a possibility. In the end, Windstone wants to put out a product that reflects their good name, and not every piece entered would be able to make the cut. As far as I’m concerned, all of the pieces that I have been working on repairing and would need a repaint are staying with me. If Windstone rejected a piece, hey – I keep it! Of course rejection hurts, but that’s part of the risk of putting yourself out there.
As far as what you said about a pay cut – yes, it probably would be! But personally, to have a piece of mine sold by Windstone itself would be well worth that pay cut. I don’t think I’d try to do repaints as a job – it would be a nice perk for breathing life back into a piece, and doing it well.
Commission spots are currently closed! Please message me for details.
Please visit My Webpage to see my art and PYO's that I've done in the past!Here is a question to all of the artists that are saying yes to this. Even I have to look at this. Could you honestly hear the words,” Sorry, but your painting is not good enough.” and still support it? Just think about it. If this is a serious idea being considered hear, and we are getting the privileged of being able to share our opinions on this idea, we need to be equally serious about the realism of this idea.
Yes, a big part of being an artist is learning to accept criticism. And there’s also the fact that your work might very well be utterly fantastic, but it’s not what the client (company) is looking for. That is a major dose of realism.
Also, if this takes a contractual approach, becoming an official Windstone painter might mean you have to forego any PYO commissions. If I’m not mistaken, Windstone painters (Jen and Arlla) cannot take commissions nor sell their work directly to the public. They have to go through Windstone (which is understandable).
My third fear is someone bashing a perfectly good Windstone just to jump on the repaint bandwagon. Would the damaged pieces come directly from Windstone?
As interesting as this idea sounds, I can see it becoming really messy. :~
This is a bit off topic right now, but I’m wondering if John/Windstone could set up a file…or maybe somebody can host something off site where we could send pictures of repaints, so there is a record of them. I have a few and they aren’t going anywhere, but being one of the oldest on this group, mine would be theoretically be some of the first to come up for sale (when I’m gone). I wouldn’t reveal the painters’ names publicly, but they could claim credit if they so desired.
Comments or any other ideas along this line?
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