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Hello Windstone forum,
Just to let everyone know, whether you send money through Pay Pal as payment or personal,
there is NO Pay Pal protection for purchases OUTSIDE of Ebay. I just got ripped off by a guy on Craigslist.
( I am going to post a warning about him too) He told me that his dragon was mint except for the tag being bent. He also told me that he was meticulous about wrapping and storing his Windstone. Well, I trusted him and purchased his dragon thinking it was mint. I did NOT send the money as personal/gift, I sent it as regular/payment. When the dragon arrived it was NOT mint and it was not damaged during shipping because none of the chips were in the wrapping. I tried to contact him but he would not return my messages. I contacted Pay Pal thinking that since I had paid for it the
” safe ” way, that they would get involved. They told me that because I had sent the
money ” outside ” of Ebay, there was nothing that they could do except let me
file a dispute. The only thing that did was to freeze his acct for 20 days. I am
sure that he had already gotten the money out of his acct so that did nothing.
In 20 days the case will be automatically dropped. All he has to do is sit and wait,
then his acct is free again but I already knew that he has 2 accts with them!
The ONLY time that they will get involved is when you don’t receive the item.
I don’t know how they get involved but it would have been better for me if he had
never sent it or it got lost in the mail, according to the Pay Pay rep, that I spoke
with. Well, it has been one week since I filed my ” dispute ” and of course nothing is going to be done. Now I KNOW that ANY purchase I make OUTSIDE of
Ebay, is at my own risk! I am sharing this with you so you will be aware of the
“false ” protection that Pay Pal doesn’t tell you about. Please be extra careful
when you make purchases outside of Ebay so the same thing that happened to me,
doesn’t happen to you. I thought that since I had paid the ” correct ” way, that
I would be covered. Boy, did I find out the hard way. I hope that I did not
scare you, I just wanted to make you aware.I want to make everyone aware of Pay Pals ” buyers protection ” so you don’t have a false sense of security. I really trusted that Pay Pal would help me but I was wrong.
Take care and good night.
Please read 2nd POST so no one purchases anything from this liar and cheat!Thanks for the warning.
Just an addition to that, Paypal will do nothing for you outside Ebay even if you never receive the item. There is a warning in red letters that states “Avoid scams and fraud by dealing locally!” Thats because you have no guarantee that they will ship the item and there is absolutely no way to get in contact with the seller once they pull their listing! I do not recomment using CL to have someone ship something to you, ever. CL has all those places listed so you can find a location near you and pick up items in person.
Pixie, it sucks that the item is not mint… but I think you are really lucky that they shipped it to you at all. They could have ignored you and there is nothing you could have done about it. Be careful on CL and deal locally.
I posted this because Pay Pal does not have ANY protection on ANYTHING that is
not purchased on Ebay, not just Craigslist. I thought that no matter who I sent the money to,
(Craigslist, forum members, on line, etc ) that if I sent it as regular payment, NOT as personal/gift,
that my purchases would be covered under their ” buyers protection” but it is not. I know that I took
a risk with purchasing something off of craigslist but I have never had a problem with someone until
now. I know many people purchase things off Craigslist and have their item/s shipped to them. Most
sellers are honest and true. My post is only to make people aware that Pay Pal ONLY gives their
” buyers protection ” on purchases through Ebay only. They told me that someday, maybe, they will
have it on all purchases but not now.Thanks for the information Pixie-dust. I did not know that PayPal did not give protection outside of Ebay (then again this doesn’t shock me either, considering Ebay owns Paypal, which has led to a lawsuit (if memory serves me correctly), since Ebay only lets you use Paypal now). I know many companies and even forums use Paypal as a forum of payment. Unless it’s a trusted company/business I’m making the transaction with, I try to go with using a credit card as payment through paypal and just pay my credit card, since I’d at least have protection through the credit card company. I never use a debit card…. which you shouldn’t use for online purchases anyways). I’ve only used Craigslist once, but that was because the windstone was actually local to me, so I could pick him up (since they wanted to charge a ridiculous amount for shipping, and it was far cheaper to drive…. plus it was an emperor in mint, if dusty, condition. I wanted him to get home in one piece). I’ll probably just use Craigslist if I can get it locally myself or have someone else do so for me. Still, it is a good warning for those of use who were not aware of this. Thanks for posting this. :yes:
Paypal does offer some help to those that complete purchases outside of eBay, but yes indeed their ‘Buyer Protection’ only applies to eBay now (ugh).
Their Buyer Complaint process however does apply to items outside of eBay and offers some help, but only if you didn’t get the item at all:
Quote:13.5 PayPal Buyer Complaint Policy.
1. PayPal Buyer Complaint Policy. The Buyer Complaint Policy is PayPal’s process to help you resolve a problem directly with the Seller through the PayPal Resolution Center for purchases that are not eligible for PayPal Buyer Protection.
The PayPal Buyer Complaint Policy is similar to PayPal Buyer Protection in that it enables buyers to file Disputes for Items Not Received (INR), or for items that are Significantly Not as Described (SNAD). By filing a Dispute, you can communicate with the Seller and attempt to resolve the problem. If you are unable to resolve the problem, you may escalate an Item Not Received (INR) Dispute to a Claim – but you may not escalate a Significantly Not as Described Dispute to a Claim.You may not file a dispute for a Personal Payment.
Even though you may escalate an Item Not Received Dispute to a Claim, you are not guaranteed recovery. If the Claim is decided in your favor, your recovery is limited to the amounts that PayPal can recover from the Seller’s Account.
2. Buyer Complaint Process. Similar to PayPal Buyer Protection, you must file a Dispute in the PayPal Resolution Center within 45 days of the date you sent the payment. Once you have done so, you should attempt to resolve the Dispute directly with the Seller.If you are unable to resolve the Dispute directly with the Seller then you may escalate the Dispute to a Claim within 20 days of the date you filed the Dispute. PayPal will make a final decision for some – but not all – Claims. You should not escalate a Dispute for Significantly Not as Described (SNAD) to a Claim because PayPal will not make a decision on a SNAD Claim under the PayPal Buyer Complaint Policy.
If PayPal makes a final decision in your favor, we will collect any available funds in the Seller’s PayPal balance at that time. However, recovery is not guaranteed and is limited only to the amounts that PayPal can recover from the Seller’s Account. Any amounts collected from the Seller will be placed in your Account.
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My art: featherdust.comIf I may suggest, in addition:
If you are looking to make an online purchase and the seller is offering only Paypal (many small time businesses… such as my own… can only offer this option) and you are not sure if you trust them or not, keep a credit card that you know will protect you in case of fraud (read your Credit card user agreements and policies carefully!!!). You can use a credit card to complete transactions using Paypal buttons!! You do NOT need to use a Paypal account. This way if you are scammed, you can file a complaint with your credit card company and hopefully get the charge reversed. Your credit card company should offer you better protection in this regard than Paypal does (if not, maybe you should shop for a better card!).
Never attempt to file a Paypal claim and a credit card claim at the same time.Note that doing credit card transactions through Paypal cost the seller more in fees than a ‘normal’ Paypal transaction. EDIT: This was on their old structure! Now it costs the same, so ignore this. 🙂
Volunteer mod- I'm here to help! Email me for the best response: nambroth at gmail.com
My art: featherdust.comSounding like a broken record, but if you paid with a credit card, you can do a chargeback through your credit card company. And if not, I’m sorry 🙁
Jennifer wrote:Note that doing credit card transactions through Paypal cost the seller more in fees than a ‘normal’ Paypal transaction.
How so? Paypal’s website lists the fees as 2.9%+.30 (3.9% international, under $3,000,) regardless of how you pay for purchases. The exception to this is personal payments- their is no fee if you use a balance or your bank account. I always pay with credit card, and I’ve received payment through credit cards, and I’ve never noticed an extra fee. So what circumstances are sellers getting dinged extra than the rate of ~3%? Not trying to put you on the spot, but if there is a case, then I’d like to know in what instances my credit card payment is burdening someone.
Lokie wrote:Sounding like a broken record, but if you paid with a credit card, you can do a chargeback through your credit card company. And if not, I’m sorry 🙁
Jennifer wrote:Note that doing credit card transactions through Paypal cost the seller more in fees than a ‘normal’ Paypal transaction.
How so? Paypal’s website lists the fees as 2.9%+.30 (3.9% international, under $3,000,) regardless of how you pay for purchases. The exception to this is personal payments- their is no fee if you use a balance or your bank account. I always pay with credit card, and I’ve received payment through credit cards, and I’ve never noticed an extra fee. So what circumstances are sellers getting dinged extra than the rate of ~3%? Not trying to put you on the spot, but if there is a case, then I’d like to know in what instances my credit card payment is burdening someone.
I say: Because as a Seller, in order to accept Credit Card Payments thru PayPal, you have to get the Premier Account (now I did this years ago so I am not sure anymore) and to have A Premier PayPal Account you are charged a higher PayPal fee……..and I don’t even know what it is but it is a lot to me LOL :/
To Pixie-dust: If you paid for an item using a service (PayPal) and you are unhappy with the item or it was falsely described (broken), and the service (PayPal) doesn’t assist you in any way but they keep their fee (from Seller), then you might just visit the BBB online, and file a complaint against the service (PayPal) that you used. I have used this method two times in the past six years, and have always gotten my money back. Because you see, if you had not used the service (PayPal), you would not be in this predicament – you wouldn’t have been able to buy your item.
I’m sorry you are going thru this, but I only use Craigslist to pick up locally.
Also, I am sure to use my credit card thru PayPal as well, for extra protection.::hugs::
What Poem just said is a good idea. With all these transactions going through the internet and I thought Paypal protected you when you used their service! It’s getting to the point that if you don’t know the person or company you may not want to deal with them. I know there are a lot of people out there like our own Jennifer, who are up front and honest. But a few of these bad apples can spoil it for everyone!
Poems wrote:I say: Because as a Seller, in order to accept Credit Card Payments thru PayPal, you have to get the Premier Account (now I did this years ago so I am not sure anymore) and to have A Premier PayPal Account you are charged a higher PayPal fee……..and I don’t even know what it is but it is a lot to me LOL :/
Ah, I can understand it individuals are relying on old policies for reference. Paypal’s accounts are a bit different now. The transaction fees are the same for Paypal’s Personal, Premier, and Business accounts. And all three accounts are free. So you don’t get any transaction fee “discount” with a Personal account. Or to think about it this way, you don’t pay higher fees with a Premier account. Actually, I’m not even sure what the benefit of a Personal account is to even still have it as a Paypal account option. :shrug: Maybe someone can enlighten me 🙂
Thanks for the advice Pixie-Dust and everybody else. I always pay for my online purchases thru Paypal via my checking account if possible but I think from now on I wil use a credit card when it is not from eBay.
I stand corrected; I was incorrectly thinking there were different brackets for CC payments which does not seem to be the case anymore. I apologize!
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My art: featherdust.comJennifer wrote:I stand corrected; I was incorrectly thinking there were different brackets for CC payments which does not seem to be the case anymore. I apologize!
NP from me. I just wanted to make sure there wasn’t some obscure fee condition unbeknownst to me as I always use my credit card for the added protection.
It did used to be structured differently; payments originating from money sitting in a paypal account had less of a fee charged to the seller than a payment pulled off of a credit card. I was not aware that it changed and I think you for bringing it to my attention!! 🙂
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